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Old 02-04-2010, 10:14 PM
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Default Canada Exempt from "Buy American" policy

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The deal, which may be announced tomorrow, will allow use of Canadian products in many local U.S. projects funded by the stimulus program, said the official, who asked not to be identified because the accord hasn't been made public. Canada also gets access beyond the stimulus to supply 37 states that signed up for the World Trade Organization's government procurement pact.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:26 PM
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Psykoh and his groupies are about to go wild.......
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Between 2001 - 2004, we (ny'ers) used to have a few meats a year in and around nyc/LI area. Those were always fun and lots of "regulars" would show up.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:30 PM
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Yeah, this should be a win for them. The original policy, courtesy of Obama, was silly and cost lots of companies money and good businesses revenue. Protectionism is basically a union on a National scale.
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:46 AM
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The problem was that the "Buy American" policies for government funded projects would have tripled the costs in many cases. I mean, the F-22/JSF project costs alone would have over doubled because of material cost overages. Steel products from Canada are still a lot cheaper (for equal quality) than US made ones.

I'm sort of surprised that the bill was introduced as it was. American Companies ignoring Canadian materials would just mean that Canadian companies would sell to China/Europe at a higher price.
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Old 02-05-2010, 10:15 AM
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The problem was that the "Buy American" policies for government funded projects would have tripled the costs in many cases. I mean, the F-22/JSF project costs alone would have over doubled because of material cost overages. Steel products from Canada are still a lot cheaper (for equal quality) than US made ones.

I'm sort of surprised that the bill was introduced as it was. American Companies ignoring Canadian materials would just mean that Canadian companies would sell to China/Europe at a higher price.
Yes, exactly. Ignoring competition on a global scale and instead rewarding mediocrity internally hurts everyone involved. Forcing company A to buy higher priced products from company B, who can't compete globally, just raises the costs for company A which means they are hurting their ability to compete globally as well. It hurts company A by raising their costs. It hurts company B by making them think they can get away with mediocrity and not being able to compete on a global level. And it hurts company C that they would have bought from otherwise. It is a lose-lose-lose situation and makes no sense to me...
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Old 02-05-2010, 04:33 PM
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Point of order - the F-22 was the Raptor, the JSF is the F-35. I say "was" for the F-22 because there is not currently any funded production. In any case, I assume you are talking about the JSF.
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Old 02-05-2010, 05:35 PM
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What it should be is Buy American from non-union companies. That will keep the bloated costs down and keep the money in America while de-unionizing most large companies.
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Old 02-05-2010, 05:37 PM
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And any miitary spending should be 98% American manufactured. That means every step of the way should be american manufactured from raw materials to finished product. We should not rely on any potential enemy for our military needs (and yes Canada is a potential enemy).
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by kierandill [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Point of order - the F-22 was the Raptor, the JSF is the F-35. I say "was" for the F-22 because there is not currently any funded production. In any case, I assume you are talking about the JSF.
Yep, I stand corrected.

I read an article about a year and a bit ago that was talking about the "buy American" clause, and how the cost of aluminum (boxite ore specifically) from Canada was significantly cheaper and it would drive up the cost of military aviation by about 30% (IIRC) if contractors had to exclusively buy US-made Aluminum.

If the F-22 and Comanche helicopter had stayed in manufacture, the point would have been further underscored.

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And any miitary spending should be 98% American manufactured. That means every step of the way should be american manufactured from raw materials to finished product. We should not rely on any potential enemy for our military needs (and yes Canada is a potential enemy).
I understand your point, but a few caveats:
- Buying exclusively US-made materials would increase costs astronomically.
- Increasing costs for available items would cripple future development.
- It would drink your available oil supply dry.
- It would further drive up costs for civil purposes as resources dry up.

Titanium, Magnesium, Aluminum (Boxite), Manganese, Tungsten, Iridium, Tin, Platinum.... these are all major components of military use metals. Most of them are not available in sufficient quantity or quality within the USA or its protectorates and territories. Sorry man, that 98% mark is unrealistic.

Point of fact: the SR-71 Blackbird reconnaissance aircraft's airframe and fuselage plating is made from Titanium sourced 100% from the USSR at the height of the cold war. No other metal easily found in the US could make the grade, so it was sourced at pretty hefty expense.

The only 2 tangible benefits you could glean from the 98% mark would be that lower reserves of X resource would force innovation, and recycling of metal would improve efficiency in manufacture/re-manufacture.
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Old 02-05-2010, 11:34 PM
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WTF... what the fuck are we going to invade? ... maryland?

Your enemy?... we're going to simply buy your ass when your country goes on the forclosure block.

Don't look now but there is a boogie man in your closet...

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We should not rely on any potential enemy for our military needs (and yes Canada is a potential enemy).
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Old 02-06-2010, 01:21 AM
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Don't look now but there is a boogie man in your closet...
we'll just instigate an armed conflict between taiwan and china...
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Old 02-07-2010, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Robmac [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
WTF... what the fuck are we going to invade? ... maryland?

Your enemy?... we're going to simply buy your ass when your country goes on the forclosure block.

Don't look now but there is a boogie man in your closet...
Rob: They're still smarting about outnumbering all the loyalists in 1812 and still getting beat back. Madison put out a mice meal for the invaders.... Lovely hosts.
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Old 02-08-2010, 10:49 AM
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In twenty years time when their country is broke and their military is in shambles, we will come in the night and take what we want... and they won't be able to do anything about it.

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Rob: They're still smarting about outnumbering all the loyalists in 1812 and still getting beat back. Madison put out a mice meal for the invaders.... Lovely hosts.
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Old 02-08-2010, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Robmac [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
WTF... what the fuck are we going to invade? ... maryland?

Your enemy?... we're going to simply buy your ass when your country goes on the forclosure block.

Don't look now but there is a boogie man in your closet...

Think back to your history: Why did Japan invade China?
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Old 02-08-2010, 05:45 PM
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Think back to your history: Why did Japan invade China?
Energy demands and to rape Chinese women.

We got all the oil in Canada and our women are hotter, especially French speaking ones. Case closed.

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In twenty years time when their country is broke and their military is in shambles, we will come in the night and take what we want... and they won't be able to do anything about it.
Unfortunately, it will the Chinese that do the buying. If you check the west coast, Chinese are buying up almost everything already.
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Old 02-10-2010, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Al Bundy's Friend Griff [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Think back to your history: Why did Japan invade China?
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Originally Posted by Xtrema [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Energy demands and to rape Chinese women.

We got all the oil in Canada and our women are hotter, especially French speaking ones. Case closed.
We also have weed, good weed.

If we invade, I'm taking New Orleans and St. Thomas. Any objections?
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